The cost of settlements will be passed on to us. The Glocks trigger had caught on a fold in the leather holster and it pushed the trigger part way back. Yesterday, a Canadian news outlet, CBC News, published a story regarding the unintended discharge last year of a SIG P320 by a Canadian Special Operator, resulting in injury and his unit withdrawing the pistol from service. Companies stay silent First, keep in mind that allegations made in lawsuits are not statements of fact. So even if, as the ambulance chaser claims, the striker leg could vibrate off of the sear face, it could not discharge unless the drop safety was also disengaged because the drop safety prevents movement of the striker sufficient to make the firing pin protrude from the breech face. Which in and of itself is user error / misuse. This guy had been working at the LGS for over a decade and never had an AD or ND, he was the strictest when it came to safety. And they think hey have an actual legit lawsuit on their hands? Hey, Im glad theres somethings we agree on! The real tell is that of all the cases, most are cops of some kind. You did get to sit and watch it with him, which leads to a serious question. OR some gorilla with more brawn than brains ignored the 40lb trigger pull they suddenly had to break the tab. Was it his fault? Manual safeties on pistols, hammer and striker fired systems were found necessary as far back as 1900. Bagnell also represented Virginia Sheriffs Deputy Marcie Vadnais who sued SIG when she said her P320 went off on its own when she was removing the weapon from her belt. Vadnais was featured in the Nightline version of ABCs report. I sold that pistol when I got it back. The sheriff's office said its investigation found no mechanical problems with its deputy's gun. Canadas highly-trained counterterrorism force, JTF-2, is the only military unit with the SIG P320 in its inventory right now. So if, say, a person was to accidentally get shot through no fault of their own and need to sue, which specific cartridge/appendage combo would yield the most favorable least pain/permanent-damage : highest-payout ratio? So your fanboy perjorative falls not only flat but false. . One hell of a conspiracy. Maybe its a technical issue, maybe its a training issue. He is acting as a consultant in the Collette suit that was filed last week. For the moron Neanderthals of the Far Right who will scream its the operators fault and we do not give a shit about marketing more safer designed weapons, if such idiotic polices were followed for other consumer goods today we would not have safety glass, anti-lock breaks, back up safeties, child proof medicine caps and chemical bottles, back up cameras, kick back muzzles on chain saws and the list goes on and on. And have the dropping 320 go off? I still own them all. Happy with my old S&W revolvers, 3rd Gen S&W pistols,1911s and a slew of P226s. It was expensive. First I have no problem with the Mk 25 or any other Sig thats metal. Sigs are crap! The same should hold true for the insane marketing of pistols like the totally unsafe Glock. The SIG P320, which has been manufactured since 2014, is known to go off without the trigger being pulled if it's dropped and lands on the ground at a certain angle. Good job! Some of the plaintiffs claim the pistol can fire without the trigger even being touched. Note that Harrisons comment about these claims possibly being the result of legal momentum were edited out of the longer Nightline version of the report. The thing is, youd probably need to generate many Gs of force in both directions simultaneously. I just separate Shatner the man from Kirk the character, which he plays with Shakespearian operatic perfection. The guide rod is cheap and breaks, it has rotten front sights! converted to the Glock denomination, but are now screaming that the P320 is Too new, not worked out! He would have been booted after the first time, but being a cop comes with some special privileges. Withe the P320 Sigs contract was $169.5 million, $103 million cheaper then Glock. in Capitalvania. Ive seen similar situations at our Municipal range. Much has been made of Nimoys Spock being the most popular character in TOS, but Id argue that without Shatners over-the-top swagger and brash manner, the balance would be lost. Sig P320 Accidental Discharge 2021 Perhaps nothing speaks more clearly to the need for a total recall than the fact that in 2021, over four years after Sig Sauer offered its voluntary upgrade, people are still suffering injuries and lawsuits continue to be filed. The second accidental shooting happened after police supervisors internally raised questions about the safety of the SIG Sauer P320. I dont care about the upgrade that should never happen. Sig, take this firearm off the market, and recall. Period. The lawsuit, filed Wednesday on behalf of . abprototype.com can add the manual safety as well as add the notches in the grip frame. He was told to shoot two rounds. The design was incorporated from Bruce Grays trigger kit around the time of the original drop safety fix. Who function tests their firearm 1) with a round in the chamber, and 2) when its pointed at an extremity? Its just dumb enough to sound like the plot to a damned Disney film. The weapon had a history of going off unexpectedly when it was dropped at a certain angle. That focus drifts. I love when people call law enforcement officers highly trained. Most dont get more training than what they had in the academy unless they are getting paid time to train, or are going for something speciality such as S.W.A.T. These officers are not gunfighters. saw the video, doesnt explain how it bypasses striker pin safety. Anyway there was one good thing to come from those movies, The USS Vengeance. Fundamentally, the bits that the ambulance chaser claims are flawed function exactly the same way as a S&W M&P. Its pathetic how often these legal stunts work. Again the Far Right Stupidity and hypocrisy is infinite. Sig Sauer's headquarters are located in New Hampshire at Pease International Tradeport. Asked if the guns in these cases could have been mishandled, Villani responds, When I see videos of police officers getting out of their car and their weapon discharges in their holsters, nah, theres a problem with the gun. ABC then ran bodycam footage of a pre-upgrade P320 firing as a Michigan state trooper exited his patrol car in 2016 with no mention of the results of any subsequent investigation. With the redesign, you would have to implement a LOT of force to move the trigger backwards. Not only is it now the designated sidearm of all branches of the U.S. military, there are over a million of them in civilian hands. The P320 pistol is a dog. The use of a modified [SIG] P226 holster created an unsafe condition by allowing a foreign object to enter the holster, causing the unintended discharge.. LOL! They suck and Im awesome!, 2. About $300. No Warp core, just a quantum singularity, The engine was basically a dorm fridge. How many times did Shatner actually watch it? Being highly trained doesnt eliminate stupidity. Dude, your story is THREE years old. TidalWave Professional Aug 25, 2021 #17 Bassbob said: Somehow I seriously doubt the guns just shot themselves. Canadian Special Forces Command has not said what caused the gun to go off unexpectedly, but the company said a conclusion has been reached. brakes, remember? Not just police in US had issues with sig p320. On Nov. 5, 2020, a recently-purchased SIG Sauer P320 pistol went off unexpectedly at a training range in Dwyer Hill, outside of Ottawa. Aint been nothing but problems since the military dropped the 1911, what was it 85 year of trusted service? Wont last!. But it also has much worse quality control on the parts in my experience owning and working on both. Search Texas Statutes. Harrison stated that, I have not seen enough to convince me that the upgraded version is dangerous., When ABCs David Scott asked Harrison if its a mystery whats going wrong with the updated version though Harrison had just stated the upgraded pistol isnt dangerous Harrison said, I do not have an explanation for why the updated version should have complaints from trained individuals. PDs are dropping them from contracts. Not only is it now the designated sidearm of all branches of the U.S. military, there are over a million of them in civilian hands. Hello perpetrators, Lee Paige is clearly the gift that keeps on giving though our buddy Hunter Biden is a close second! ALL OF THEM. Id read that for TMP, they got NASA to help in the design of the refit Enterprise. You would have to conclude theres a problem with the product, not with the people., In the Nightline version, Bagnell says, Firearms are not subject to federal regulation. I dont own a Glock or a SIG and am not a fanboy of either. There are several stories about her in the news for various no reasons, she must be throwing them out by a dozen. Had a buddy, years ago, that was a deputy for Orange County in California. 00:03. These lawsuits ARE about SIG making defective weapons. The networks report didnt mention lawsuits filed by LEOs (or anyone else) against other gun makers claiming similar alleged design defects. The Glock fails on both counts. On February 19, 2021, Military.com reported: A former U.S. Marine and federal agent has filed a $10 million lawsuit against Sig Sauer Inc. alleging that his holstered Sig P320 a pistol that the Army's new sidearm is based on accidentally discharged, firing a 9mm bullet into his right leg. The claimed mode of failure was that the tab on the drop safety that interferes with the striker movement had been sheered off and stopped being a drop safety. If these same folks were around in the 80s and got their way, no one today would know what a Glock was. I have no idea. They both underwent full testing but while the Sig was the cheaper handgun ($1.50), it also quoted higher costs for magazines and spare parts, boosting the overall cost of the acquisition. Once word of that got out there was an avalanche of sexual harassment lawsuits against Fox news. there is no better. "It has a clear capacity to fire without the trigger being pulled under certain conditions," said Hilton's lawyer, Jeffrey Bagnell. Who knows. The P320 Voluntary Upgrade Program is a SIG SAUER initiative to upgrade P320 pistols at no additional cost . There are a few examples, I admitS&Ws M&P from around 2014 were near junk and I wouldnt have bothered to own one as a trotline weight, but apparently S&W had righted that ship since then. Thinking its okay to wrap a loaded gun in a towel and toss it into a gym bag is what we get when departments refuse to hire candidates who score too high on IQ tests. in 2021," Bagnell said of the overall scope of the concern . Heres the version that ran Tuesday morning during the networks Good Morning America program . Theyve gotten tons of contracts because the gun is cheap, cheap, cheap to make. The cheap seats were $100-$200 and you got to watch Wrath of Khan with Shatner. The new Kirk does suck. Canadian soldier wounded by accidental discharge used wrong holster: SIG Sauer I wouldnt be surprised if she did it intentionally, she clearly suffers from a serious case of media whoring. After watching a friend get killed by a Remington 700 by another friend and the ensuing fallout 31 years ago I decided that I didnt care if the P320 was fixed, it was getting sold. People of the Gun are probably familiar with the early problems the P320 had regarding drop safety. If you want to find the lowest form of life on the planet interview any C.E.O. In 2020, the agent, who is a former marine, was doing his routine training with the P320. Anyway around here they do. In my opinion, the only reason SIG would have done that is if they knew there was a safety problem with the original gun, otherwise they would not have done it., Scott says Harrison reviewed the claims in Officer Hiltons lawsuit and said, its unclear to (Harrison) what could now be causing misfires in the upgraded guns., Scott then asked Harrison if he believes the P320 should be removed from the marketplace. 01:10. Not sure why it wont let me reply to you, but Ill reply to myself in the hope youll get it. The SIG will be the shortest military contract for guns in history. Having it as the ONLY trigger pull the weapon has seems (to me) clearly dangerous. I wont argue theyre wrong, I dont own one, dont want to. . Using an example from the first prong, we legitimately fault the user who shot himself in the palm, rightfully asking why in the WORLD his palm was in front of the muzzle when he set the gun down. SIG ultimately settled that lawsuit. With the 320, the striker is in full-cock position, and held there through the operation of the trigger sear and the positive striker-blocking safety. This subject has two prongs; One is the negligence of those who have shot themselves with 320s through violations of Rule 2, the other the possible mechanical design failing of the gun. Sig can burn for all I care. -You plan on getting rid of your P320, great! Glocks biggest problem is they havent innovated since 1985. I would trust a hungry lion on the Serengeti plains of Africa more than I would a C.E.O. NO, SIG has a problem that they would rather fight in court. And people have a way of looking for ways to deflect blame for those discharges, especially when they stand to lose their job as a result. Theyve also been adopted as duty guns by law enforcement agencies across the country. But this time, the sound bites used were different. Dont quote the four rules of safety in your article when all the hotness in the gun world is appendix carry pointing something at an extremity and the photos you use showing front slide serrationsputting your hands fingers near the business end of the barrel, because press checks from the front is the way all the cool operator guys do it. Great job, this threat needed some levity! Whats the difference between a $600 Sig and a $300 Taurus? The pictures on the internet were enough to scare the shit out of you especially his wound in the thigh. Sig makes a damn fine weapon and theres nothing wrong with it. Attorney Bagnell held up the law enforcement officers he represents as examples of people who are highly trained in carrying and using firearms. As a striker-fired pistol, the P320 is "under constant pressure to fire," Bagnell said. They passed every state and national drop test requirement out there. If its not legal momentum, it would have to be some other mechanism of failure.. Ron, The current allegations, then, are different, claiming that the P320 is prone to un-commanded discharges.. The fact is that the plaintiffs will get paid regardless of who did what. They didnt see a problem at all and in fact, saw it as an upgrade over Glock. But I hope Sig fights it until the bitterest of ends. Over the top, hammy and with incredible choleric energy, but as he once said, when you trying to seriously sell a scene that has space ship with obvious carboard walls, christmas lights and a guy in a rubber gorilla suit with a plastic horn on its head, if you play it lowkey youre dead the audience is gonna focus on how cheesy it all is. Would you? Thats why the US Marines have Sigs. An x-ray (fluoroscope) of the mechanism in operation could show what, if anything, is happening inside the gun that might prove, or disprove, the contention that the gun is flawed. Personally they should have gone with the Glock, its not for me but is a proven gun. Covid ruined that gravy train for him but hes still doing the conventions. Sep 20, 2021 613 571 Idaho. Thats fine. They've also been adopted as duty guns by law enforcement agencies across the country. Especially since they farm it out to the lowest bidder. Upgrades are for things that didnt work right in the first place. Additional questions about the Voluntary Upgrade Program are answered in the FAQ. In 2021 you would think a company would understand MIM metallurgy. Asking for a friend. The new guy sucks. Its also interesting that theres apparently no corresponding flood of civilian lawsuits against SIG with similar claims of guns going off, even though the public owns far more P320s than do law enforcement agencies. But then Im not a federal LE flunky who cant keep my booger hook off the bang switch, either. Hes talking about trial lawyers recruiting clients whove experienced negligent discharges with P320s and suing the gun manufacturer. Charlton, headquartered in Victoria, B.C., for comment on its original story, but neither responded. Depending on who you talk to you will get many different answers. Why you and I are arguing over a gun that neither owns or will own, (The defect couldnt be duplicated after the crash.). It alleges that Walter Collette, Jr., a police officer with the Somerville (Mass.) People who had problems have been replacing them with Lightning Strike SS ones. Ever since the internet went mainstream I have read about the Sigs decline. Effectively: you must be this dumb to get this job. Hes like the arrogant star QB on your favorite football teamyeah, you would never want to spend a weekend with him at the lake cabin, but your franchise would be little to nothing without him. ! while being accompanied by some form of obvious stupidity like putting an unholstered gun in a gym bag with other stuff. If the gangster greed monger criminal Capitalvanians in the gun industry had their products under the jurisdiction of the consumer safety administration all the newer striker fired guns would never have been allowed on the market unless they had manual safeties and a safe take down system. I have never had to have one serviced or replaced. Fair enough. This highly trained Fibbie was doing flips while dancing (breakdancing? Police Department, was wounded when his P320 duty gun discharged without a trigger pull while he was carrying it in a gym bag wrapped carefully with a cloth. Officer Collette was wounded in his left leg. She claims that her holstered P320 pistol went off while she was carrying it in her purse. You need a lead that can be the lightening rod and not be afraid to make an ass of themselvesit give the watcher permission to take it seriously. Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. A fine of up to $10,000. To give you an example of early self-propelled lawn mowers if you lost your grip on the handles the mower would not shut off and it would take off on its own right down the street all by itself. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jsu6WsSQ2_g. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h-ZZ6pynGLM All polymer guns are cheap, cheap, cheap to make, thats why I threw the Taurus name into the mix. 2. The settlement requires the gunmaker to reimburse owners of . But it hardly indicts the P320 as a badly engineered weapon or that its worse than another brand. It may be a rotten trigger, but it does highlight the fact it has a much lighter trigger compared to classic semi-autos and revolvers. In June, Cambridge police Lt. Thomas Ahern filed suit, accusing Sig Sauer of selling a dangerously defective product after his P320 fired on its own while he was in the department's SWAT team van with six other officers.
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